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Hiker
Posts: 25
Accepted Solution

Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

So I want to start off and say I've owned a few different GoPro's and I've been happy. 

 

I purchased a Fusion about 2 weeks ago, and I am absolutely floored by how bad of an overall product this thing is.... 

 

My requirements are (and I dont think these are that difficult):

 

  • Be able to do overcapture type editing with 20-30 minute clips on mobile
  • GPS overlay on mobile

That's it. I dont use true 360 footage. Since I use this camera for car track days, its nice to have shots from all around the cars that I can edit into standard footage. 

 

Issues:

 

  1. Overcapture is terrible. The fact keyframing isn't supported is a little odd.
  2. Even worse is the fact that on the mobile app, there is no way to combine clips on the mobile editing platform over 7 minutes.
  3. No way to transfer media over USB (takes 30 minutes+ to transfer each 7 minute clip over WiFi).
  4. GPS overlay doesn't even work when using overcapture.
  5. Even if I use desktop, I have an i9 6 core MacBook Pro, stitching takes 4 hours for a 20 minute clip.
  6. Can't extract GPS data easily to use in other software
  7. etc.

 

I mean, is this not kind of crazy? The video quality I really like, but to edit a 20 minute clip, it's not possible in camera, so I have to use a desktop, sucks, but it is what it is. But 1 hours worth of footage requires almost 24 hours to just render. Combine that with the fact there is no software to extract gps for overlays (I have to buy software thats Mac compatible). This seems like a half baked product that makes me feel like i got scammed. I mean the "beta" came out in January of this year and it STILL hasn't been released.

 

What's going on and what's the roadmap for this product? The max has the same specs (more or less), so what's the plan for these two devices?


Accepted Solutions
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Explorer
Posts: 12,961

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

Yes, you probably would have been better off waiting for the Max and not going with the Fusion. While MAX will be getting new desktop software that will hopefully be compatible with Fusion files (but you'll still need to stitch/render in Fusion Studio), at this point we don't know what the new software will be like. Key framing, as mentioned earlier is expected in the GoPro app for Max as well as Fusion. Wi-Fi transfer of large video files is what it is. That's a limitation of the phone and current technology. Yes, the telemetry extractor is only going to be able to work with one file at a time. FAT32 limitation causes the chaptering. I doubt we'll see a change with this either.

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Tourist
Posts: 2

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

That is quite big ask, the file sized you are talking about are massive! 

I would just stick to doing short highlights.

have a look at the youtube clip i have linked below, The Max seems to be heading in the right direction in regard to mobile usability.

 

Check this out:

https://youtu.be/gy5zClAirQU

 

sheers.

I'm giving you guys a sneak peek at the new 360 ReFrame tools coming with the launch of GoPro Max. Get a basic understanding of how key-framing works with th...
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Explorer
Posts: 12,961

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

I was just about to write the same thing as @lukerogersws

@swifthike8236 you're a bit ambitious with what you think can (or should) be possible with 360 video. Especially when it comes to editing on a mobile device (which, BTW, will be getting key framing - see video posted above). It's very doubtful that we'll see any significant changes to Fusion. The "Beta" update was for gathering data for MAX. It doubt it will ever be officially launched. Fusion was always in the Prosumer category and was pretty much understood to be an introductory model to shape future GoPro 360 cameras. MAX is the result of that effort and will most likely be seeing all of the focus for the next year or two (until the next 360 camera is released).

BTW, you don't need to pay money to extract the GPS and other metadata. You can use this member created tool https://tailorandwayne.com/gopro-telemetry-extractor/#

Finally, what GPU do you have and how much on-board memory does it have? I had an i7 with GTX 1050ti and rendering was pretty slow (but manageable). i switched to a RTX 2060 and cut the render time nearly in half.
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Hiker
Posts: 25

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

Really?

Rylo and Insta360 cameras do this.

The telemetry extractor only does 1 7 minute file at a time. So you must upload each clip, extract gpx, then combine each gpx file.

As far as stitching, you shouldn’t need a $700 you for it to work quickly. Once again the other competitors do this much quicker.
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Explorer
Posts: 12,961

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

What is your experience with those cameras? Your making a lot of 20-30 minute videos quickly on those devices, huh? How long is the render time?

Rylo and Insta360 are both inferior cameras than Fusion, although I think it's fair to say the Insta360 OneX is better all around (but you didn't mention this camera).

You can complain all that you want, but the answer is still the same.

As far as not needing a good GPU for rendering to work quickly.....ummmm, what do you think GPUs are for? Granted, they are mostly discussed in the gaming industry, but the who point of the GPU is rendering video. Whether it's for video games or video editors, the Graphical Processing Unit does the heavy lifting for...Graphical Processing. Saying that you shouldn't need a fast GPU to work quickly is like saying you shouldn't need a race car to go fast on the race track. You can have a professional driver, but if you give him a Hyundai, he's not going to win may races. he may finish, but he's not going to do so "quickly".
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Hiker
Posts: 25

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

I meant the one x, not the one.

I understand what a GPU is for. And I’m talking comparative times. From my understanding, the max has in camera stitching, if this is the case, then would it not be fair to say a pro Vega 20 gpu would be sufficient? I say this understanding the architecture of how a gpu works.

Having tested the Rylo and the Insta360, they both do what I want well and within a reasonable time frame.

Basically, what I’m getting from you all is that I made a mistake. I bought the Fusion on a leap of faith (didn’t test it) because I was already into the GoPro ecosystem and it seems there will not be any future support. While the Rylo and one x may not have the same image quality, the workflow is vastly superior for my use case.

But you’re not going to sell me the terrible workflow as a failure of the system. It’s been shown by other manufacturers that it’s absolutely possible to create a reasonable workflow. Keep in mind, stitching is only 1 of the issues.
Highlighted
Explorer
Posts: 12,961

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

Yes, you probably would have been better off waiting for the Max and not going with the Fusion. While MAX will be getting new desktop software that will hopefully be compatible with Fusion files (but you'll still need to stitch/render in Fusion Studio), at this point we don't know what the new software will be like. Key framing, as mentioned earlier is expected in the GoPro app for Max as well as Fusion. Wi-Fi transfer of large video files is what it is. That's a limitation of the phone and current technology. Yes, the telemetry extractor is only going to be able to work with one file at a time. FAT32 limitation causes the chaptering. I doubt we'll see a change with this either.
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Nomad
Posts: 3,227

Re: Will the Fusion/Max be supported in the future?

Issues:

Overcapture is terrible. The fact keyframing isn't supported is a little odd.

Keyframing is supported in the new version of the app coming soon, I've been told by GoPro this will work for both Fusion and Max camera's.

 

Even worse is the fact that on the mobile app, there is no way to combine clips on the mobile editing platform over 7 minutes.

Professional video editors use professional equipment.  The mobile app is for making QUIK (see the clues in the name) short clips for mobile upload.  The average viewer on youtube only watches 30 seconds of video before leaving.  So using market research the mobile app was developed for people who need QUICK short chips.

 

No way to transfer media over USB (takes 30 minutes+ to transfer each 7 minute clip over WiFi).GPS overlay doesn't even work when using overcapture.

There's a USB port on the side of the camera, but it's much quicker just to remove the SD cards and transfer files that way.  You're avoiding the bottleneck of the USB transfer speeds that way.

 

Even if I use desktop, I have an i9 6 core MacBook Pro, stitching takes 4 hours for a 20 minute clip.Can't extract GPS data easily to use in other softwareetc.

I've a core I7 6 core laptop running Windows 10, it takes me about an hour to render a 20 minute clip.  I can't believe your MacBook pro is so slow.  You should try rendering your clips to and from an SSD and make sure you have 32GB of ram to speed things up.

 

Of course the real topping on this cake of problems is the following:

"Be able to do overcapture type editing with 20-30 minute clips on mobile"  "That's it. I dont use true 360 footage"

 

So let me get this straight..........   you want to be able to edit 20 - 30 MINUTES of footage, footage that could easily top 230GB once it's rendered........ on a mobile device.....    Wow, just wow.  You don't expect much at all do you?

 

Also, you want to edit 20 - 30 minutes of overcapture footage........ but you don't use true 360 footage........    Do you even know how overcapture works?  Let me put it this way, overcapture works by letting you crop footage......... FROM TRUE 360 DEGREE FOOTAGE...  So you cannot have over capture without having to edit TRUE 360 DEGREE FOOTAGE...  by creating an overcapture shot, you are having to use TRUE 360 FOOTAGE as a source file